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Hey Folks,


So, been riding for a while now (10 years) and until the last year motorbikes were the only way to get around. After a change in career (teaching to QS) I have had 2 issues. 1) less time on the bike due to be lumbered with a company car. I still take the bike in when commuting, but get some serious frowns if I use it to go from office to office 2) Though I like the new job, and seems to be a good fit for me with a decent promotional ladder etc, being a bean counter in a construction company has left me slightly unfulfilled in terms of what I do in wider society.


As a result, I have decided that I want to join the local blood bike group. Just to give back a bit and get on the bike more again. Obviously, this requires advance riding qualification, and I am planning the IAM route, through recommendation of my local group, and I had considered it with them before a something to do in a summer.


Question being, has anyone done this? How difficult is it to pass? From an observational perspective I feel I have good observation and am constantly looking around, but it seems an area which may be a bit grey at this stage is positioning. Positioning for the best view, but not compromising safety seems like it could be a matter of opinion in some cases. Are the observers generally looking for all round safety and some evidence of intentional positional change, or is it a much more strict, prescribed methodology than this? And other things, like at what point would you be expected to make an overtake. I understand making progress, but if we are in a 60 zone and the guy in front is hovering around 50/55, personally in a test situation I wouldn't really consider this a massive hindrance to my progress as such.


Appreciate your thoughts.

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I expect that you'll find a fair degree of variation between observers, especially in the guy-in-front-doing-55-in-a-60 situation. But the observers are supposed to be reasonable well-tuned into what the local examiners are looking for; they get feedback from them, especially when people don't quite make the grade, so they should be armed with all the information you need. They'll give you feedback on your riding which is intended to get you through the exam.

My tip would be to just go along and enjoy the riding. If you get on ok with your observer you'll really enjoy it. If you don't, though, don't be shy to ask for a different one.

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1. but it seems an area which may be a bit grey at this stage is positioning. Positioning for the best view, but not compromising safety seems like it could be a matter of opinion in some cases.


2. Are the observers generally looking for all round safety and some evidence of intentional positional change, or is it a much more strict, prescribed methodology than this?


3. And other things, like at what point would you be expected to make an overtake. I understand making progress, but if we are in a 60 zone and the guy in front is hovering around 50/55, personally in a test situation I wouldn't really consider this a massive hindrance to my progress as such.


Appreciate your thoughts.

 

Speaking as an ex-ROSPA Associate Tutor, I would say.....


1. Road positioning. Consider your side of the road as being divided into 5 zones or "mini-lanes" - 1 being the gutter, 5 being just to the inside of the crown of the road. Zone 1 is unusable - could you react in time if an animal ran out? What about the potholes that inevitably inhabit this part of the road? Ditto the gravel and crap that accumulates here. Zone 2 - OK. Same as path swept by n/s tyres of car, so clean. Zone 3 - might look OK but inevitably oily/greasy due to stuff dropping off car sumps and diff. So don't use it. Zone 4 - OK. Same as path swept by o/s tyres of car, so clean. Zone 5 puts you too close to the path of oncoming traffic so generally don't use it unless you can see your path to be clear. So for general positioning for view, that leaves you with 2 or 4.


2. "All round safety" is your sole objective. Anything that compromises it is verboten. They are not looking for "some evidence of intentional position change" - what they are looking for is evidence that every facet of your ride is planned and executed in an integrated and coordinated way that flows seamlessly as you make progress and which is obviously the product of a process of consideration. This process of consideration includes taking into account things that may or may not happen - e.g. animals running out, cars/bikes cutting blind bends, etc. That is why the central maxim of any advanced riding course is invariably "be able to stop in the distance you can see to be clear". Imagine that your ride is being filmed by someone following you - you should be able to justify what you are doing, have just done or are going to do at any point in the ride.


3. You would be expected to make an overtake when it would enable you to "make progress" with regard to the prevalent road conditions and the behaviour of other road users. If, therefore, you were following someone doing 58 in a 60, (a) - you would not be able to overtake safely, in a timely manner, without breaking the speed limit (and contrary to popular belief, IAM and ROSPA members do NOT posess a magical immunity from the law of the land - speeding is speeding is speeding, and if you get busted, tough titty.) (b) - what would be the point? Where would any advantage lie? Seeing the overtaken victim receding in your mirrors at a majestic 2 mph? Don't think so.


As I say, just my 10p worth, but it seems to have worked for me.

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3. And other things, like at what point would you be expected to make an overtake. I understand making progress, but if we are in a 60 zone and the guy in front is hovering around 50/55, personally in a test situation I wouldn't really consider this a massive hindrance to my progress as such.


Appreciate your thoughts.

 


Being one if those riders who have for years seen overtakes in this scenario as a 'why bother'

Ie in a nsl and following at 56 mph ...yes i could give it a squirt past and get to 70 and pass ... but im happy and just enjoying the ride so trundle on ...

Have recently taken the IAM masters and thankfully past with distinction .the benefit i found doing this was everything has to be spot on legal so your overtakes are limited as anything over posted limit is a fail but it was drummed into me that even though the overtake may not be on ... make it apparent that you have considered the possibility but decided to not continue ..ie move up to overtake position but then drop back to safe distance .

In other words keep engaged in the ride.

The examiner will prefer to be out for a ride with a thinking rider who may make mistakes but keeps them engaged rather than someone who rides like a scripted ride and is switched off

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even though the overtake may not be on ... make it apparent that you have considered the possibility but decided to not continue ..ie move up to overtake position but then drop back to safe distance....

But if you can see that the overtake "is not on" - then so can the examiner. What, then, is the point of moving around in the road unnecessarily? All that you are doing is introducing a redundant dynamic into the ride that serves only to complicate things. Actually, what you are describing are the actions of someone who is not reading the road sufficiently far ahead, who moves into the overtaking position only to see that the move cannot be made and who is then forced to fall back from an overtaking position that was never justified in the first place.


And people that are "switched off" will never produce anything like a scripted ride. It's just not possible to do it over the duration of an entire advanced test .

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Thanks for all the suggestions.


Good to be back on here, been a while. Massive work commitments at the moment.


I am more than happy to pay me money and get stuck in. Either way it will be informative I am sure. Just with a masters going on, and work development assessments I am a little test weary at the moment but this being different as something I want to do.


Sounds like observer opinions will vary. I like the idea of pretending to be filmed, just looking for an overall objective to keep in mind to keep my head right. Also sounds more like adaptability and open mindedness over 'difficulty'?

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even though the overtake may not be on ... make it apparent that you have considered the possibility but decided to not continue ..ie move up to overtake position but then drop back to safe distance....

But if you can see that the overtake "is not on" - then so can the examiner. What, then, is the point of moving around in the road unnecessarily? All that you are doing is introducing a redundant dynamic into the ride that serves only to complicate things. Actually, what you are describing are the actions of someone who is not reading the road sufficiently far ahead, who moves into the overtaking position only to see that the move cannot be made and who is then forced to fall back from an overtaking position that was never justified in the first place.


And people that are "switched off" will never produce anything like a scripted ride. It's just not possible to do it over the duration of an entire advanced test .

My wording is slightly wrong i agree ..

If the overtake is definitely not possible then no moving into overtake position is wrong but when it a possibility but not 100% definite then showing that decision process shows engagement .


Again my description is inadequate .

As switched off i mean not thinking and is riding as the book reads .

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even though the overtake may not be on ... make it apparent that you have considered the possibility but decided to not continue ..ie move up to overtake position but then drop back to safe distance....

But if you can see that the overtake "is not on" - then so can the examiner. What, then, is the point of moving around in the road unnecessarily? All that you are doing is introducing a redundant dynamic into the ride that serves only to complicate things. Actually, what you are describing are the actions of someone who is not reading the road sufficiently far ahead, who moves into the overtaking position only to see that the move cannot be made and who is then forced to fall back from an overtaking position that was never justified in the first place.


And people that are "switched off" will never produce anything like a scripted ride. It's just not possible to do it over the duration of an entire advanced test .

My wording is slightly wrong i agree ..

If the overtake is definitely not possible then no moving into overtake position is wrong but when it a possibility but not 100% definite then showing that decision process shows engagement .


Again my description is inadequate .

As switched off i mean not thinking and is riding as the book reads .

OK Tim - I can see where you're coming from. :thumb:

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...just looking for an overall objective to keep in mind to keep my head right. Also sounds more like adaptability and open mindedness over 'difficulty'?

What I found useful was the idea of making the ride "flow" and become a single entity rather than just being a load of things that you do or that happen to you during the ride. What I mean is to get into the habit of thinking about what you have just done, how it has had an influence on what you are doing now, and how what you are doing now is going to influence what you will do next. The ride then becomes a series of flowing, sequenced events that are informed by a logical sequence of considered decisions.


For example, we read about "information links" in the books but do you really use them to inform the way that you plan the next bit of the ride? The classic example being the roundabout lighting that is often visible long before you come to the roundabout or its signing. Use the knowledge that a roundabout is coming up to inform your speed and position in the carriageway.


So, first learn to identify the "bits" or "components" of a competent ride, then be able to execute them and then learn to assemble them into a polished performance. As you get more used to this, it will become progressively easier to do and the "difficulty" will dissappear.


And finally, buy, read and understand "Roadcraft". There is another very useful tome called "Not the Blue Book" that will pay dividends if you study it.


All the best


S23

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A few years ago I arranged one of those free taster ride out's with a local observer.


He turned up on his RT1200 and we had a chat and then discussed the route he wanted me to follow. We put our helmets on and I fired my bike up and waited for him, and waited. He couldn't get his bike started. Sounded like the battery was kaput. We tried to bump it couple of times and failed. He called his breakdown and I stayed with him for about an hour and a half chatting until they turned up.



I never bothered after that :lol:

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  • 7 months later...

Hey Folks,


Been a while and I like to try and update these things with an end result.


So, after a few lessons, and a bit of a wait to get a test date, I have now passed the advance. Was a bit worried on test date because a) I knew of I failed a retreat would be happening December at some point by the time it got arranged and b) it was in Plymouth, some police incident was on and Marsh Mills roundabout is generally a pain in the ass but all was well.


Enjoyable experience and good riding. Do I feel safer? Possibly not, but I feel work a fair amount of experience you get to know what hazards to look for, but I do feel much smother and quicker through extending the view etc.


As for blood bikes, unfortunately, on the same week I passed they change their insurance so the age limit went from 25 to 30. Still doing the fundraising though, and talks are happening around whether I can use my own bike while waiting.

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Well done [mention]Rik398[/mention] . I passed my IAM Advanced Rider on Saturday and the examiner suggested I look at doing the IAM Masters if I wanted to improve my skills further. Blood bikes is an option I am considering and some areas certainly allow use of your own bike on certain conditions, listed on national blood bikes website.

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Congrats on the advance.


I would recommend the blood bikes, you can try it and see as most groups want you to do a bit of volunteering before riding, and often they have stands at bike nights and car shows and things which can be a cool way to spend the day. Other times it's just holding a bucket at a supermarket but surprisingly fun as most people involved seem fairly sound.


Yeah hopefully I can use my own bike and be covered by my own insurance in the interim. I do think having a minimum age of 30 is a little harsh, they're are a few people I know who are interested but probably won't get involved now which is a shame. But then I works day that as in our group it only affects me!

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