No back brake after a very twist and turns ride ..

Hi am . As you see its been a very hot day today .. so me and my bro in law went for a fast blast on the bikes . .I'm on CB750 he's on a FJR1300 and like to go fast .so we goes up to the Brecon beacons and he said he's found a new road to ride so we been on the road good 2hrs . And we came to the last section he said got a lot of twists and turns ..... So off we go I'm doing my best to keep up with him . Then about the last few miles I'm going.round this hair pin bend goes to.slow down ready to accelerate out in to the bend and NO BACK BRAKE so knocks it down a gear and use more front brake then feel a.small amount of.back brake . So I pulls in stops (using the front brake) has a potch around can't see anything by this time he's come back !!!what's up !!! Got no back brake .. then I feel the brake caliper its MAD HOT .. so jumps on the bike down to the next garage air/ water ... runs the cold water on the caliper and the brake pipes disk all over the braking .... after 5mins off we go and it as good as new there's brand new pads in there less than 200 miles. Then we head home its most M4 but the back brake worked all right all way home . So i. Asking is that normal ??????

Is the brake fluid need changing

As I was using the brakes a lot to keep up with him an round the bends ..

So any info will be fantastic.. Iain ..

I think it’s called brake fade.

Riding the back brake too hard, or unintentionally over a period of time will cause it to over heat and lose feeling- never happened to me as I obviously don’t give the bakes a hard enough time. Hi

If it happens again I wouldn't pour cold water on it in case this causes something to crack . The only thing you could do is rebuild the calliper with new seals and check to see if the pads have become glazed . Normally when a rear calliper gets very hot it actually sticks on rather than fails to stop the bike so I'm not too sure what has happened here . Hope you sort it soon .

Sounds like brake fade, the pads exceeded their ideal operating temperature.

If they were only 200 miles old,maybe they were not bedded in before working them hard?

What make pads were they?

I fitted some non descript pads to my car and they were complete sh1te,poor braking and juddering.

To add to the above...

Are you possibly resting your foot on the pedal slightly when riding?

Another likely cause is that that the pistons are not retracting properly causing the pads to rub on the disk - this will cause the brakes to get hot quickly and fade. Take the caliper off and have a look, see what condition the seals are in - possibly dirt in behind the dust seals causing it to grip the piston and too hard? Unlikely fluid is the reason unless the system is drastically over filled.

Are they definitely th correct pad size?

Could also be your riding/braking technique. If you're braking hard at almost every corner then try easing off a little on the straights and carrying a bit more speed in the bends instead. There's not really much need to be hammering the brakes when road riding, even at pace. The exception being downhill on proper alpine style roads which we don't have many of in the UK. Squirt, brake, squirt, brake isn't really a good technique. Apologies if this is not what what you're doing, but I've seen plenty others do so riding in the twisty parts of Scotland.

you have boiled the fluid! the chances are its well over a change and it will have water in it which boils quicker than the fluid and it will lower the boiling point of the fluid too

now you have boiled it you need to change it

I have had this once the lever just went straight down with no resistance at all

Also check to make sure the caliper is not binding as this will cause it to happen quicker than just using the brake

Also make sure that the rear caliper still floats ok......This often gets neglected .....The rear caliper on my cb750 was completely seized.....I had to buy a replacement as I couldn't unseize it.....

The rear pads in my GSXR are the original Nissin ones that have been in there for 25 years and 43000 miles . Given that I have two large floating disks and two six piston callipers on the front , I have always regarded the little disk and two piston calliper on the back as purely for cosmetic purposes . So not much danger of my rear brake heating up because I hardly ever use it .

Who fitted the new pads. Did they clean the pistons before pushing them in to fit the new pads.

Hi thanks bits of info there... the pads are ECB gold .shintered type .for sports bikes (hard braking) .

The back caliper is working fine as it was me using my foot and leaning back so I could see the caliper move to see if it was sticking . It worked perfect .it was me checking the caliper then that I felt it was so hot .

My foot when on the foot rest is about inch above the brake pedel so i have to push my foot down to stop so it not binding or riding with my foot on it .

I have to speed up to catch my bro in law on the str8s as he zooms round the bends i cant go as fast as him round the bends as i go wide some Times (almost every time there a ruddy car or bus coming the opposite way ) so I don't go round the bends as.fast but to.day I did as I approached the bend slowed down a bit fast then as I went round the bend I opened the throtel which helped me go a bit quicker . But again he's gone so again hard on the gas then fast braking so it was me using the brake.that made it hot there no.fault with the bike ..(just.the rider lol)

So I need to change the fluid .

It's the only thing i didn't do after I bought it (2 years now )

So I guess it due a brake fluid change .

Once I put the cold water on it (it didn't hisss or make any sound as it was boiling hot it was just to hot to hold long )

It worked perfect then as we was on the way home and it was M4 hardly touched the brakes then when I did they was 100%.

I changed them . I used brake cleaner to.clean it.as the old pads was ECB touring pads and.they worn down fast . Then i put copper grease on the back of the pads and a bit on the caliper as it was almost all the way out greased it and.pushed it.back in put the pads in . The pads done over 100 miles more i think...before today ..and two up as.well for 99%time one up to.day.

ride to your comfort levels and pace .

that way you're not relying on the bike to get you out of trouble !

if your riding too hard into a corner that you need to stop yourself going wide on YOU'RE RIDING BEYOND YOUR LIMIT way before you've even got to the corner .

That style of riding heavy accel & harsh brake works on a track but road riding it will not end well .

Sounds like your riding techniqur tbh. Might be worth looking into some time with an advanced riding instructor and some track timr., It'll improve your riding no end. Spanking it down the straight and hammering the brakes isn't a good way of doing things. Smooth is fast. Try spending some time on your own riding at your own pace. Find a twisty road and slow things down to focus on your lines through the corners (hold the outside line around the bend until you can see the corner starting to open up again. This gives you the best view and room to play with if the corner tightens up). Try to ride (at a sensible speed) without using the brakes, just slow down using engine braking and I bet the smoothness you'll get without upsetting the bike with with heavy braking will allow you to go faster through the bends.

Also learn about limit point analysis.

Watch this https://youtu.be/pagriJOuH0g

What Stu said about the fluid boiling. It's a hydraulic system so if the fluid is old and has now got water absorbed in it (brake fluid is hydroscopic) at heat the water boils which creates a gas bubble. You can compress gas so that takes the hydraulic action out of the brake fluid.

As he said, replace the fluid regularly.

brake fluid should be replaced every two years minimum, probably more often if you are riding more aggressively

Thanks every one . I'll change the fluid tommorw .. it's only when I'm with him I ride like that as its to keep up with him. On my own I take my time and it better . Got to honest chasing him takes the fun out of the ride . If take too long he winges and moans . !! I was up there last week and I did it an hour faster !! Well I'm going to stop as if I feck up its me whos going to get hurt or some one else or the bike going to get bust .

I like the comment about the advanced ride I'll look in to that .. so cheers a very one . Two probs sorted ..

. If take too long he winges and moans . !!

Tell him he'll have to wait a lot longer if you end up in a hedge.... riding outside your comfort zone isn't something anyone should be pressured into doing. If he's that much of a whiner pick a cafe to meet up in and he can get the brews in whilst he waits

Was there any smell from the brake? If not, I think you got away with it, just and if it is working fine, it was brake fade. If there was any smell, you have cooked the pad and should change it. You could change the brake fluid and if it happens again, I would really recommend you let it cool down naturally and not with cold water.

Hi no smell . Just.hot not boiling.hot.but hot. I changed the brake fluid . Looked like cloudy piss. So nice yellow in there.now.. works.all good.. cheers