Motorbike usb cable

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Stu
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Re: Motorbike usb cable

Post by Stu » Fri Jul 07, 2017 8:42 am

Baloo wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 8:34 am
Stu wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 7:20 am
Comparing electric to water is not the same! A smaller wire would still supply 12v!
A smaller wire can carry less current, just like a smaller diameter pipe can flow less water. We aren't talking about voltage here, my water analogy is talking about current draw, which is measured in amps.

It's a perfectly fair analogy to use to simplify the law of conversion of energy in an electrical circuit.

If the circuitry is generating heat as Joeman suggests
and like your phone charger is generating heat and noise, than that circuit is leaking energy, just the same as the valve in my analogy is dripping water.

Still nobody's provided evidence that these things do generate heat.
If you was carrying the same voltage then yes you would be right! its electronics converting 12 to 5 volts that's the issue its the converting that has the small draw

there is no dripping tap affect as the end power has nowhere to go! its a different circuit using the power
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Re: Motorbike usb cable

Post by Mgrhiki » Fri Jul 07, 2017 9:05 am

Hi guys i email the company yesterday.i recieve email from them just now saying In the normal condition, this item will not consume the power if not using even you don't remove the fuse.what they mean by normal condition?

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Re: Motorbike usb cable

Post by JRH » Fri Jul 07, 2017 9:30 am

As said in my earlier posts re the 240 volt domestic socket outlets with a USB charge, some manufacturers provide a figure for the power consumed in Watts when there are NO items connected. and as others have said electronic used to step down a voltage consume power all the time they are connected [mention]Baloo[/mention] like your leaking pipe.
As the power loss is relatively low the amount of heat generated will also be low and probably not noticeable.
So in the general scheme of thing it is unlikely to run down your battery.
I found this where someone has already done the tests on a USB convertor. the current draw on the one he tested is a bit high as it has a LED to show it is on. But neverthe less the bottom line is unless it has a physical switch it will draw current but not enough to worry the battery.

Even so I would power it from ignition controlled supply.
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Re: Motorbike usb cable

Post by JRH » Fri Jul 07, 2017 9:43 am

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Re: Motorbike usb cable

Post by Baloo » Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:13 am

Stu wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 8:42 am
Baloo wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 8:34 am
Stu wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 7:20 am
Comparing electric to water is not the same! A smaller wire would still supply 12v!
A smaller wire can carry less current, just like a smaller diameter pipe can flow less water. We aren't talking about voltage here, my water analogy is talking about current draw, which is measured in amps.

It's a perfectly fair analogy to use to simplify the law of conversion of energy in an electrical circuit.

If the circuitry is generating heat as Joeman suggests
and like your phone charger is generating heat and noise, than that circuit is leaking energy, just the same as the valve in my analogy is dripping water.

Still nobody's provided evidence that these things do generate heat.
If you was carrying the same voltage then yes you would be right! its electronics converting 12 to 5 volts that's the issue its the converting that has the small draw

there is no dripping tap affect as the end power has nowhere to go! its a different circuit using the power
If the power has nowhere to go, then it is drawing no current, go read

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservation_of_energy

It has to be creating heat, noise, light, magnetic field, or something otherwise it is drawing no current. These are the dripping tap.

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Re: Motorbike usb cable

Post by Stu » Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:15 am

Baloo wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:13 am
Stu wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 8:42 am
Baloo wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 8:34 am


A smaller wire can carry less current, just like a smaller diameter pipe can flow less water. We aren't talking about voltage here, my water analogy is talking about current draw, which is measured in amps.

It's a perfectly fair analogy to use to simplify the law of conversion of energy in an electrical circuit.

If the circuitry is generating heat as Joeman suggests
and like your phone charger is generating heat and noise, than that circuit is leaking energy, just the same as the valve in my analogy is dripping water.

Still nobody's provided evidence that these things do generate heat.
If you was carrying the same voltage then yes you would be right! its electronics converting 12 to 5 volts that's the issue its the converting that has the small draw

there is no dripping tap affect as the end power has nowhere to go! its a different circuit using the power
If the power has nowhere to go, then it is drawing no current, go read

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservation_of_energy

It has to be creating heat, noise, light, magnetic field, or something otherwise it is drawing no current. These are the dripping tap.
Maybe you should learn to read and re read what EVERYONE is saying :roll: :roll: :roll:
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Baloo

Re: Motorbike usb cable

Post by Baloo » Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:20 am

JRH wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 9:30 am
As said in my earlier posts re the 240 volt domestic socket outlets with a USB charge, some manufacturers provide a figure for the power consumed in Watts when there are NO items connected. and as others have said electronic used to step down a voltage consume power all the time they are connected @Baloo like your leaking pipe.
As the power loss is relatively low the amount of heat generated will also be low and probably not noticeable.
So in the general scheme of thing it is unlikely to run down your battery.
I found this where someone has already done the tests on a USB convertor. the current draw on the one he tested is a bit high as it has a LED to show it is on. But neverthe less the bottom line is unless it has a physical switch it will draw current but not enough to worry the battery.

Even so I would power it from ignition controlled supply.
Thank you. Nice to talk to someone about it that obviously has some understanding of electrical circuits.

I would stick a multi meter on one myself and post up the results, but the only one's I have are cigarette lighter socket ones which have an LED on them, so they will give spurious results.

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Re: Motorbike usb cable

Post by Stu » Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:21 am

Baloo wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:20 am

Thank you. Nice to talk to someone about it that obviously has some understanding of electrical circuits.
wow just wow :roll: :roll: :roll:
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Re: Motorbike usb cable

Post by Baloo » Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:23 am

Stu wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:15 am
Baloo wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:13 am
Stu wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 8:42 am


If you was carrying the same voltage then yes you would be right! its electronics converting 12 to 5 volts that's the issue its the converting that has the small draw

there is no dripping tap affect as the end power has nowhere to go! its a different circuit using the power
If the power has nowhere to go, then it is drawing no current, go read

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservation_of_energy

It has to be creating heat, noise, light, magnetic field, or something otherwise it is drawing no current. These are the dripping tap.
Maybe you should learn to read and re read what EVERYONE is saying :roll: :roll: :roll:
I can read just fine, you said a different circuit is using the power, but there is no dripping tap. THAT CIRCUIT IS THE DRIPPING TAP! You also said the power has nowhere to go, which is impossible, it's has go go somewhere if it's drawing current, in this case most likely heat. You also compared the width of a pipe to voltage not current. You need to learn some more about electrical circuits so you can actually understand the analogy as JRH has above.

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Re: Motorbike usb cable

Post by Stu » Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:28 am

Baloo wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:23 am
Stu wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:15 am
Baloo wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:13 am


If the power has nowhere to go, then it is drawing no current, go read

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservation_of_energy

It has to be creating heat, noise, light, magnetic field, or something otherwise it is drawing no current. These are the dripping tap.
Maybe you should learn to read and re read what EVERYONE is saying :roll: :roll: :roll:
I can read just fine, you said a different circuit is using the power, but there is no dripping tap. THAT CIRCUIT IS THE DRIPPING TAP! you need to learn some more about electrical circuits so you can actually understand the analogy as JRH has above.
Its not a dipping tap if its using the power :roll:


but as always you're right and everyone else is wrong :roll:
Fines are taxes for doing bad, taxes are fines for doing good.

Baloo

Re: Motorbike usb cable

Post by Baloo » Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:31 am

Stu wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:28 am
Baloo wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:23 am
Stu wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:15 am


Maybe you should learn to read and re read what EVERYONE is saying :roll: :roll: :roll:
I can read just fine, you said a different circuit is using the power, but there is no dripping tap. THAT CIRCUIT IS THE DRIPPING TAP! you need to learn some more about electrical circuits so you can actually understand the analogy as JRH has above.
Its not a dipping tap if its using the power :roll:


but as always you're right and everyone else is wrong :roll:
You haven't understood the analogy, simples.

I don't quite get how you think I disagree with everyone else, you're the only one arguing about it.
JRH wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 9:30 am
and as others have said electronic used to step down a voltage consume power all the time they are connected @Baloo like your leaking pipe.

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Re: Motorbike usb cable

Post by Stu » Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:43 am

Baloo wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:31 am
Stu wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:28 am
Baloo wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:23 am


I can read just fine, you said a different circuit is using the power, but there is no dripping tap. THAT CIRCUIT IS THE DRIPPING TAP! you need to learn some more about electrical circuits so you can actually understand the analogy as JRH has above.
Its not a dipping tap if its using the power :roll:


but as always you're right and everyone else is wrong :roll:
You haven't understood the analogy, simples.

I don't quite get how you think I disagree with everyone else, you're the only one arguing about it.
JRH wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 9:30 am
and as others have said electronic used to step down a voltage consume power all the time they are connected @Baloo like your leaking pipe.
Thats because its a shite example

To me a leaking tap is something that you have tried to turn off but its still dripping! you haven't tried to turn the usb off you have merely unplugged the device! the rest is still turned on and working as it should just because something isn't consuming power at the outlet doesn't mean the usb charger isn't using power!

If you had a switch on it and turned it off and it was still using power then yes you have a leak!

It's not a leak if its doing its job
Fines are taxes for doing bad, taxes are fines for doing good.

Baloo

Re: Motorbike usb cable

Post by Baloo » Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:44 am

JRH wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 9:43 am
Edit
forgot to post link :roll:
http://www.bigmessowires.com/2016/01/28 ... r-charger/
Just seen this, perfect and it solves the debate, thank you, it draws 14.2 mA.

0.1775 watt hours @ 12.5v, so it's drawn 132 watts in a month, the alarm and immobiliser are a bigger concern.
Last edited by Baloo on Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:53 am, edited 1 time in total.

Baloo

Re: Motorbike usb cable

Post by Baloo » Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:48 am

Stu wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:43 am
Baloo wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:31 am
Stu wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:28 am


Its not a dipping tap if its using the power :roll:


but as always you're right and everyone else is wrong :roll:
You haven't understood the analogy, simples.

I don't quite get how you think I disagree with everyone else, you're the only one arguing about it.
JRH wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 9:30 am
and as others have said electronic used to step down a voltage consume power all the time they are connected @Baloo like your leaking pipe.
Thats because its a shite example

To me a leaking tap is something that you have tried to turn off but its still dripping! you haven't tried to turn the usb off you have merely unplugged the device! the rest is still turned on and working as it should just because something isn't consuming power at the outlet doesn't mean the usb charger isn't using power!

If you had a switch on it and turned it off and it was still using power then yes you have a leak!

It's not a leak if its doing its job
It's a perfect analogy, the 5v circuit isn't drawing any power as nothing is plugged in, the 12v circuit is drawing 14.2mA, so that 14.2 has to be leaking out somewhere in the middle as current can't flow unless it is going somewhere. In this case it's energy being "lost" to heat, just as a leak will loose water from a pipe.

Heat in an electrical circuit is deemed to be a "loss" as it's not achieving anything towards powering the USB device.

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Re: Motorbike usb cable

Post by Stu » Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:53 am

its not been lost its been used :?

IMO its not a leak if its been used in what its supposed to be doing

I would agree to a leak if power was been used that shouldn't be thus flattening the battery
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